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Saturday, April 9, 2011
Children Shot At - Farview Park
12:47 AM | 
Posted by
The I.I. |
This blog thread posted by the Irving Inquisition uses some explicit language, as well as depicting some aspects of life in North Minneapolis that some readers may find objectionable. Reader discretion is advised.
Children Shot At -- Farview Park
Three or four days ago, my friend's nephew and his friends were threatened by an Asian gang of approximately twenty gangsters at the bus stop on 29th and Dupont Avenue North.
Fast forward to about 10pm this evening. My friend's nephew had just finished playing basketball at the Farview rec center. As they were leaving, four members of the fore mentioned gang approached them; one of the gangsters was armed with a gun. Human instinct took over, my friend's nephew and his friends froze. That is until the armed gangster started shooting at the group of friends.
My friend's nephew and friends bolted away for dear life. They ran the long away around the park to avoid being followed back home. Once hearing about the terrifying incident, my friend called the MPD. Over the course of the 911 call, my friend specifically asked MPD to come to his home on the east side of Farview Park to take a statement.
How did MPD respond to my friend's emergency call? They told him that because the shooting incident occurred in the park, and therefore he needed to call park police instead. That statement in of itself is unbelievable, but the next part will knock your socks off. When my friend called the park police, they told him to call back after 8 o'clock in the morning because they were closed. So he called MPD back at 911 and they finally agreed to send somebody over.
Finally a squad car pulled up to the house. Just as my friend walked out the front door to go speak with the officer, the squad car pulled away. My friend called back two more times, only to be rebuffed with comments of the police being too busy.
I arrived at my friend's house, not knowing about any of this. He told me the whole story about what happened. At this point, the wait time for a police response had exceeded an hour. Just to put things into perspective here, the police response time in this case for children being shot at is completely unacceptable. If you can't count on the cops to protect you, what are you going to do?
The next step is to call the guy that's known for getting things done. I called Don Samuels around 11:45pm and woke the poor guy up. He was groggy, so I shared the story with him as clear and concise as possible. Unfortunately there wasn't much he could do at that particular point in time, as the Minneapolis political machine is closed Friday late nights. In addition to that, Farview Park is in Hawthorne, which is Diane Hofstede's ward. It would be logical to contact Ms. Hofstede next, seeing as it is her ward anyway. I asked Samuels for Hofstede's contact information. He informed me that she was away in Europe.
After three phone calls to the police, and hours of waiting, the police finally arrive at 12:22am as this blogger was composing this very post. The officer recorded my friend's nephew's statement in a professional manner. That part is fine, but I think the whole point about tonight's story is that when residents call the police to ask for help because their own family members are being shot at; a sense of urgency is implied.
Everyone be on the lookout for a heavily armed, trigger happy gangsters, shooting at people around Farview Park. That being said, don't expect much help from the police. Their response time this evening was about an hour and a half.
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33 comments:
Umm, seems like the time to call the police would have been immediately after the shooting incident happened. You don't wait any longer than absolutely needed to tell the cops. Every minute that passes makes it so that even if they did find the people responsible for firing off the gun, they've already had time to hide or ditch the gun and make up some bullshit story or alibi.
Minneapolis on a Friday night in springtime is a damn busy place. The cops have to get to things that are actually in the process of happening. Plus, waiting to call the cops on something like that does seem pretty strange. I was told once by one of their dispatchers on the phone that once you've gone beyond a 10 or 15 minute time frame after something has happened it goes from being in process of happening to being a report after the fact, and the cops aren't about to go all lights and sirens to write a report.
That park thing is weird, but that's also why if your car gets broken into on park property, a park cop will actually come out for a report. If, instead your car gets broken into downtown or someplace, you're told to call 311 the next day. the park cops and the city cops are like 2 different departments or something. I think it boils down to a jurisdiction thing -probably the same reason why they didn't send a Brooklyn Park officer or a St Paul officer to talk to them.
The police seem to take far too cavalier an attitude regarding gunshots. Just because the bullet failed to meet flesh is no defense of the intent of brandishing and discharging such a weapon. It is still a felony, yet weapon discharge reports don't seem to get reported to the public.
Another annoying fact is that the police don't seem to be interested in patrolling our neighborhoods; waiting instead for a 911 call indicating a crime has already been committed.
Now that crime reports in NoMi are down from previous years, the police need to take a much more proactive role in preventing crime. Had this occurred perhaps the Asian gang who were loitering in the park would not feel so emboldened.
Of course, I realize how difficult this is when some officers primary goal is to rack up $60,000+ of overtime. http://x2t.com/91810
Maybe that money should be used to put additional feet on the ground rather than having exhausted patrol officers responding to crimes that have already occurred.
Maybe your idiot friend should utilize better situational awareness and not be at a shitty inner city park at 10pm on a Friday night.
The reality is there are bad people who prey on the naive, suburban eduacted white leftist liberals who believe that they can rationalize with the ignorant, impoverished inner city youth that obviously havent had the same access to education and opportunities because they arent white, suburban middle class.
Get over it. There will always be predators and prey. Be a victim and ignore the red flags, or refuse to be a victim and stand up for your self.
The inner city is never going to be a safe zone. Wall it up and let the indigents fight over the scraps. Your friend should stay in the suburbs.
MPD is the equivalent of SF teams in Viet Nam. They can rely upon each other to make it through a shift and maybe a career, perhaps make a difference in their assigned patrol area but in the end, nothing is going to change. It is a war zone. No amount of social welfare will change the dynamics of the situation.
Until society comes to grips with the ugly reality of inner city demographics, it wont get better It is easier politically to throw money at the problem than adress the socio-political issues of ignorance, poverty and the perpetuation of a welfare class with no expectation for them to achieve anything beyond their impoverished, uneducated ingnorant life.
The socially concious persons belive that this demographic actually will respond to arts and education. All that they really know are base survival reactions...stimulus response. Police are bad, govt gives them free shit and they can have as many illegitiment children with as many "babies daddies" as they want with no impetus to achieve anything beyond their pathetic existence.
Forgive the irreverant and cynical repsonse, but unlike the author, I live in reality, not some hypothetical leftist socio-political theory that is flawed in application.
Wall the city up, let them kill each other and OD on crack and meth. When it is all over, I can go to the MIA and enjoy the historically significant art and neighborhoods with our fear of being car jacked, robbed, raped or assaulted by the poor ignorant slobs.
Uhh..police "respond" to a crime after it has happened. Police arent there to "protect" unless you happen to have one who lives with you or follows you around as a personal body guard.
People have becomed conditioned to the idea of not taking any steps to protect themselves.
Get a carry permit, learn to use and shoot a firearm, carry it with you and if someone attempts to rob, rape, assault or harm you, take the necessary steps to protect yourself. If that means using deadly force, so be it. What do you think cops do? Someone pulls a gun on them, they get shot.
This includes staying away from places that are inherently dangerous...like a park in Mpls at 10pm.
Wow. A lot of commentary above. But the basic point is that no matter what the circumstances, an hour and a half is too long for a response regarding a report of children being shot at.
I assume the 8:05 comment is a joke, albeit not funny. I live in the neighborhood, and it is - by and large - very safe. The concerns are lack of timely response, and confusion over jurisdiction - mprb v mpls police. That is a problem, and I would like to hear an explanation.
There was a debate once before about whether to merge the park police into the MPD, based primarily around budget issues. An incident like this certainly raises the concern over whether the dual system actually makes us safer. When kids are getting shot at and the perpetrators are still out there, it makes no sense to tell a caller to wait until morning to give a statement. Furthermore, if that's going to be the park police M.O. then the 911 dispatchers need to know this so that they do not direct such calls to an unresponsive department.
Now we hear that an officer was shot at (not to diminish that incident, but the words were shot AT, not shot and hit) and that led to the delay in the MPD response time. That and the fact that the 911 call wasn't made until long enough after the incident to warrant an immediate response. Those are understandable reasons for a slight delay, but an hour and a half is just not acceptable.
It's important to note that (knock on wood) we haven't had any homicides in the 4th precinct this year. By this time last year, if memory serves correctly, we were at eight in this precinct. To any outsiders who think that NoMi is like the wild west, keep that in mind.
The reason MPD took so long was because the report was made long after the incident had happened. The MPD no doubt had several "ongoing" issues to deal with.
Don't question why the police do what they do. They have access to a lot more information than you and no doubt are appropriately prioritizing.
God Bless the 4th Precinct. And next time let the stupid politicians sleep and leave the police work to the MPD.
Why didn't they just bop on over to the precinct at Morgan and Plymouth if they were so desperate to share their information in a timely manner (after delaying for an hour or like 4 days -the post wasn't really clear on when this happened and when the kids first tried to contact the police).
It would have been like a 3 minute trip in the car. You ever been downtown on a Friday night? If you have, you'll know the cops have their hands full with things that are actually happening. Sorry if it hurts your feelings that the cops don't have time to come out and chit chat with you when you finally get around to deciding to report something that happened much, much earlier, but I'd rather they be out breaking up fights, chasing down robbers, and stopping assaults that are actually happening in the here and now than sitting in your living room listening to you recount information that is no longer even fresh in your mind.
@ Anon 4:31,
This happened last night. I'll respond to your low-brow rabble rousing in the order from I read it.
1. People have responsibilities; besides what's the point of having 911 if you have to drive to the police station?
2. Cops having their hands full is something the general public can file under "not my problem". When you call 911 in an emergency, the police should ALWAYS be prompt.
3. If one of your family members was shot at, the event would most certainly be "fresh in your mind" regardless of whether minutes or hours have elapsed.
For the record, I spoke with CM Hofstede about this while at a Habitat for Humanity event today; she's clearly not in Europe.
i would be very interested to hear if the police or any other authorities involved used the phrase "low community standards" at any point. i say all this in the context of being very appreciative of the work that the MPD does, HOWEVER: i have had the police use the phrase "low community standards" in response to a 911 call, and i have heard other northsiders relate having heard this phrase--always as an explanation of why the requested service isn't going to be provided. i am very curious as to the status and origin of this phrase: is this MPD policy? 4th precinct policy? city policy? the phrase is bantered around enough that i don't believe that it is just coincidence. my *impression* is that it is in some resource management handbook somewhere. my response is "hey, you're talking to a member of the community, and i'm trying to work with the city to raise the bar around here, so who are you to tell me that i, a member of the community, have "low standards"? i think it's the most kafka-esque phrase in the MPD vocabulary.
Hawkman - the debate to merge the Park Police into the city police is a dead issue. A great way to alienate yourself from the Park Police (and Park Board [MPRB]) is to bring that issue back up and push for it. You need to learn the politics of Minneapolis, and one of those lessons is to keep your nose out of certain issues.
Irving:
When the Park Police are not is service the Minneapolis Police are required to respond, especially if it is a gun call.
Question: If shots were fired right outside of the Farview park building doors why didn't the park staff or anyone else call 911? Didn't anyone else hear the shots? Certainly gunfire outside of a park building would generate at least one 911 call.
If the 911 call taker told your friend to call back in the morning to talk to the Park Police about a shots fired, that person was an idiot and THEY need to make a formal complaint with 911. They can look up the call logs and play back the 911 tapes and investigate the exchange of dialog.
911 can also research the squads that responded and determine what they did and how they handled the call.
911 can also determine if there were other 911 calls related to this incident. They would also know if the "Shot Stopper" system triggered, if there are sensors in the area.
I'm not sure why you felt in necessary to get a council member out of bed. It's not their job to solve your problems. They are citizens too and are entitled to a personal life. Besides, you were not even involved in this situation, you were reporting it second hand. I just think it's kind of pompous of you to start calling city officials late at night like they owe you a response.
Anon 12:06, I remember that debate and I was actually against merging the departments at the time. But after this experience I can't help but think that might be a good idea. And if the park board or MPD can't handle some rather civilized criticism then there's not much I can do around the concern of alienating them.
Wow, lots of critics late last night. II & HH, "you should have done this" or "say that". Really? That's what you got?
Guys, don't be disswaded by the "nay-sayer". They don't want you to stand up and speak out because then the perception of this so-called "low community standard" diminishes.
Keep demanding higher performance from the public officials, whether from the city counsel, 9111, MPD or MPPD. They are paid with are tax dollars.
hey II do you what color theses gangsters were waering?
Capt Jack
Unfortunately I don't know what colors they were wearing.
Yes Yes. Lets all get guns. That will fix EVERYTHING... ..oo0(fucking morons)
I'm curious to know how much time actually did elapse between when the shots were fired and when your friend called. Definitely being shot at is an emergency situation, but depending on how long afterward it was that your friend called in makes a big difference. It sounds like the kids were home safe and out of danger, and you also said they took the long way around the park -so are we talking 5 minutes after the shooting incident before they called police, or are we talking about 20 minutes to an hour?
You characterized the situation as an emergency but then went on to say that your friend wanted the police to come out and "take a statement" -which sounds like a definite after the fact type of thing, which I wouldn't count as an emergency even though the situation they wanted to make a statement about was definitely a bad one. Just dialing 911 doesn't make something an emergency, for example, you can even call 911 to report a boom car but that doesn't make it an emergency. Though you could call to report that same boom car shooting a gun out its windows, and I would say depending on how long after it passed by you wait to call, it may or may not be an emergency. Call right away = emergency vs call 30 minutes after the car has gone by = not an emergency -at least in my view of things.
Also, how old were these children? I would hope that kids old enough to walk to the park by themselves would also be old enough to know how and when to call 911 (my little grandchild does, and she's in kindergarten), so why did their parents have to do it for them at some time after the actual incident? I'm not putting the kids down here, but it seems really odd to go about the situation like that, because at that point, you've got your dispatch person talking to somebody whose own information is 2nd hand from the children who actually were there.
I think we need more details about the facts in this case. Also, I can't imagine that the city's "shot spotting" machine wouldn't have coverage of Farview park -it would be pretty dumb if they didn't. Is there a way to find out if there was tripped off by the shots, or did the gangsters use a silencer or something?
We had an incident, about 8 years ago, where we pissed some young kid off and he showed up later that evening with a gun (we had called the police on him because he dumped stolen merchandise behind our garage). Thankfully our neighbor noticed him with the gun and talked him into leaving and not shooting at our house (with our 2 young children sleeping in the front bedroom). After he left our neighbor called us and advised us to flee our home for a few days. The police were no help! We finally went to Don Samuels, a nearby neighbor, and after he made a few calls we were contacted by a police detective. He came to our home and talked with us. It was scary to realize that the police aren't going to protect you, they will get involved after someone gets seriously hurt or killed. Forgot to mention this kid came back 2 weeks after the above incident and threw a brick through our front window. Cost us $400 and the police did nothing other than fill out a report. 8 years later I still wonder where that kid is and if he will ever come back. Not fun! It did teach me to be careful who you piss off around here. I still call the police on things but make sure no one knows about it.
Only wimps need guns!!!
A few points of clarification.
#1. There was nobody at the Park Rec Center. This happened just after the center closed and the staff had just left. No one is blaming the park staff for anything.
#2. For the commenter regarding getting a permit and arming oneself - we are talking about youth at the rec center. Are you really suggesting the youth at the rec center should be armed? Get real.
#3. For the commenter who said "Don't question the why the police do what they do. They have a lot more information than you." I would not say that this complaint is "anti police." I would bet that if you asked a cop if an hour and a half for a response regarding gunfire directed at youth in the park was acceptable, that they would agree it is not. It likely is a resource issue, not an issue of whether or not they care. I would bet 100% that they would be on board with the idea that they need more support to do what they do and actually want to be to as many incidents as quickly as possible. Highlighting incidents such as this is not denigrating the police, it is reinforcing the case that they need more resources.
Well said M. Clinton, I whole heartedly agree with all your points. And again, I'm so sorry something this scary came upon your family. Thank heavens he is okay.
I daily pick up Northside youth from Edison who stay after school for practice and drive them home. Last night while on the way home, the kids were talking again that there were more gun shots the evening before somewhere in the vicinity of the NW corner of the park (or nearby in the neighborhood). I have no idea if there is any connection, but it seems that area has been somewhat of a hot spot lately.
That is has. The other night while biking home from the river I had to stop to call the cops because I had heard some shots from north of 26th. They said thanks for the call.. Not that they will be sending a car there soon..
What happened to these kids was no joke, and it's not my intention to dismiss the issue of the police response time, which was simply unacceptable.
However, I have been to more than one public meeting with police, and they have said over and over again there are only two types of people out after dark in North Minneapolis - criminals and victims.
When I was at college in St. Paul, every year students were reminded by campus security to never walk alone after dark, and to avoid walking after dark at all.
I hope those kids will err on the side of caution in the future for their own safety and be in before dark.
Funny how the detail are changing. First they were "just leaving" after playing basketball.
Now they were hanging around after the park closed and the staff had left.
Maybe if the victims had an accurate story the police might actually have done something.
Funny how folks on the north side know if they want a quick police response to mention there was a gun involved. Cry wolf too many times and...
So were there any other calls to the police about shots fired?
Yes there was. I called. I live a block from Farview. Also funny how people who think they have something important to say always comment as Anonymous... So funny
Funny how General Disarray uses a "Pen name" to post as anonymous...also soooo funny. And lacking in credibility (look at the fake profile).
I seriously doubt that you actually made any call to 911, and are just a fake trying to counter the last commentor's point. If you called, give us your real name and time you called so we can verify it with 911, or STFU.
Those of us in the know, we know who General Disarray is. Those who aren't in the know, and who like to stalk, harass and generally obsess over the northside activists who are making positive changes in the long dysfunctional "hood" don't need to know who the real person is behind the pen name of General Disarray. It's not a fake profile, no made up stories and she does not need to STFU, but you do, Anon 5:19pm.
To anon 8:30 "Only wimps need guns."
Are fore fathers are rolling over in there graves right now. Graves full of guns protected by the constitution that all true Americans should stand up and fight for. But you aparently dont choose to exercise all of your rights, and that is ok cuz your dumb ass dosent need a gun.
Capt Jack
Big talk from Megan - the "Northside Noise". I can always tell when I score a touchdown comment because Megan has to come to the rescue. How many fake names are you using this week to harass people Megan? You and Hoff are both a couple of mouth pieces, and there is some interesting info on you floating around. Where is John hiding this week? Mississippi? Is that where he said he was going? It changes so often I lose track of his BS.
Now maybe the General can respond, that is if it's OK with Megan that other people speak for themselves.
PS Shut up Megan, you haven't done crap to revitalize Minneapolis. You're just talk.
Ha! Talk about hitting a nerve! I guess you told me, huh? Man, I don't know what to do with myself now that I have been told off by some pissed off anonymous troll on the internet. And I guess I have failed because I haven't met the revitalization standards of said anonymous troll. My life is empty now.
/sarcasm font.
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